Home
 
     HOME     ARTICLES     Frank DAIGNAULT     TROPHY RIGS     CONTENTS     FAQs     FLY FISHING     OFF ROAD 4 X 4     STRIPED BASS    SURFCASTING
 
Click for Daignault Biography Twenty Years Trophy Striper Striper Surf Striper Hot Spots MID-ATLANTIC Striper Hot Spots - NEW ENGLAND Eastern Tides Fly Fishing the Striper Surf
TWENTY YEARS ON THE CAPE - STRIPER SURF - STRIPER HOT SPOTS - THE TROPHY STRIPER
EASTERN TIDES - FLY FISHING THE STRIPER SURF
Welcome to Frank Daignault's "CASTS" - Center for Advanced Studies of Trophy Stripers.
Please be sure to read the Protocol and then join in!
 
 
Go Back   StriperSurf Forums > Main Forums > Ask Frank Daignault

Ask Frank Daignault Frank Daignault is recognized as an authority on surf fishing for striped bass. He is the author of six books and hundreds of magazine articles. Frank is a member of the Outdoor Writers of America and lectures throughout the Northeast.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #1  
Old 01-10-2013, 01:16 PM
lagoonguy lagoonguy is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,809
Default The Sounds Made by a Lure

Frank, please comment on what you feel the value is of the sounds made by a lure like the jointed Pike, etc. as it is retrieved through the water column.
BillH

Last edited by lagoonguy : 09-24-2014 at 05:04 PM.
Reply With Quote
  #2  
Old 01-11-2013, 06:10 AM
Frank Daignault's Avatar
Frank Daignault Frank Daignault is offline
Writer, Hunter, Surfcaster
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 30,458
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

I don't know what to think about sound. I know that from time to time they come out with Rattle-Traps, rattle shads or plugs with shot in them that are supposed to make noise. Still, I have often pointed out that when we crank in a fly line the reel makes a noise tht is transmitted through the line which evokes a strike. There is so much snake oil in our society that I have come to distrust everything. Would love to hear more about this most cogent idea from member experiences.
__________________
Frank
Reply With Quote
  #3  
Old 01-11-2013, 06:47 AM
joeaugeri joeaugeri is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: little ferry
Posts: 1,686
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

in my local muddy river noisey lures are a proven plus,even adding a glass rattle to a bucktail jig works wonders. we did a few side by side tests,and the bass can tell.
and you would think gulp! would realy work great,but it didnt help one bit.
Reply With Quote
  #4  
Old 01-11-2013, 08:50 AM
clambellies clambellies is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: massachusetts
Posts: 788
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

It's kind of interesting that as far as freshwater bass lures go, sound and rattles were all the rage for years, and now pressured bass may shy away from them and some bass-pros are going to lures with no rattles for a truer, more finesse presentation.

As for stripers and blues poppers and splashing pencils may call them up, but what natural sounds do baitfish actually make to attract them? Certainly not rattling ball bearing sounds.

Since I mostly use lures at night I'm more interested in the turbulence or the pressure waves that lures make, giving the bass something for their lateral lines to key in on.
Reply With Quote
  #5  
Old 01-11-2013, 01:55 PM
fishinglsister's Avatar
fishinglsister fishinglsister is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Quincy, Massachusetts
Posts: 2,005
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Quote:
Originally Posted by clambellies View Post

Since I mostly use lures at night I'm more interested in the turbulence or the pressure waves that lures make, giving the bass something for their lateral lines to key in on.
Nice Clambellies, I believe you nailed it! Note that Bill quietly slipped a smaller picture next to the Pikie of a pair of Tony Stetzko's, "Mr. Wiggley" .
That thing makes "pressure waves"!!

As far as "natural sound" goes, I love to stop my live eel about 95% of the way to the end of the cast so that it lands with a "splat" instead of a splash. I found that bass in shallow water swim right over to that sound (works well with plugs too)...........JC
__________________
Captain Jason Colby
Little Sister Charters
fishinglsister@aol.com
617-755-3740
www.littlesister1.com
Reply With Quote
  #6  
Old 01-11-2013, 04:01 PM
Team Phil's Avatar
Team Phil Team Phil is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: New York
Posts: 635
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

An extremely good topic no matter which side of the sound factor you lean toward (importance/irrelevance). I have seen little if any talk on the sound a traditional plug makes. Standard plugs with no enhancement make a real racket underwater, and the speed of sound is aprox. five times faster under water than in the air, both a striper's inner ear and lateral line are stimulated and engaged by under water sounds and vibrations, especially a pattern or repetition(positive or neutral) instead of a sudden spook or fright(c ya!!haha), and how many bass have been caught on traditional plugs??? just a thought haha
Reply With Quote
  #7  
Old 01-11-2013, 07:08 PM
joeaugeri joeaugeri is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Jul 2004
Location: little ferry
Posts: 1,686
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

a nice bottle or metal lip in the dark i can deffinatly think pressure waves sending out
something a fish could lock in on,but what about a needle ,a dropper or a buck tail? no wiggle ,wobble, nothing.
Reply With Quote
  #8  
Old 01-11-2013, 11:29 PM
Steve C. Sink's Avatar
Steve C. Sink Steve C. Sink is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2009
Location: North Carolina
Posts: 1,360
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeaugeri View Post
a nice bottle or metal lip in the dark i can deffinatly think pressure waves sending out
something a fish could lock in on,but what about a needle ,a dropper or a buck tail? no wiggle ,wobble, nothing.
JOE-----many-many years ago, I would actually dive to the bottom of a lake and let my fishing buddy pull all kinds of plugs, plastic worms, etc. close to me, to determine if I could hear'em. A plastic worm with a small weight attached, sounded like a drunk stumbling over a rock pile. In all honesty, he never pulled an unweighted worm by me dragging it on the bottom, as I recall.
A plug does not have to have rattles in it to put off a hell of a sound, under water.

MULE.
Reply With Quote
  #9  
Old 01-12-2013, 07:55 AM
lagoonguy lagoonguy is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,809
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve C. Sink View Post
JOE-----many-many years ago, I would actually dive to the bottom of a lake and let my fishing buddy pull all kinds of plugs, plastic worms, etc. close to me, to determine if I could hear'em. A plastic worm with a small weight attached, sounded like a drunk stumbling over a rock pile. In all honesty, he never pulled an unweighted worm by me dragging it on the bottom, as I recall.
A plug does not have to have rattles in it to put off a hell of a sound, under water.MULE.
And that's what prompted my question - recalling how as a kid we often snorkled for Lobsters off the rocks at Gloucester and one day a surf fisherman began casting a big Atom plug near us. Then we experimented; listning to all types of plugs; spoons, lures, etc. One of the noisiest lures I recall was a jointed Pikie lure, one of Frank's favorites.
BillH
Reply With Quote
  #10  
Old 01-12-2013, 10:56 AM
Nifty Nifty is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: MA
Posts: 812
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Underwater, I'm convinced that sonar is the dominant hunting tool. A fish may not strike your lure until it sees it but 9 out of 10 it "hears" it, or picks up on the sound waves it's giving off long before it becomes visible.

Ever go underwater and have someone else bang two stones together underwater from clear across the pond and you can hear it? That's how sensitive sound is in the fish' world. Ever wonder why they tell you not to tap on aquarium glass? It sounds like World War 3 to the fish. Meanwhile, light travels very differently underwater than above. It's much easier to see vertically than horizontally. This is the case for fish and man alike. Look straight ahead and it gets cloudy fast; look up to the surface or straight down and it's clear for quite a distance. It's called the "cone of vision" or something like that and it's very small, which is why I'm convinced that hunting for food is more effectively done through sound waves. A fish keeps zeroing in on the sounds until it sees the prey and then it either strikes or declines.

I never did notice any difference in the old belief: "light night, light lure, dark night dark lures". I've clobbered fish on dark nights with light lures and vice versa, but I have noticed a considerable increase in "quiet nights, quiet lures and rough night, noisier lures". All just my opinion, nothing scientific.
Reply With Quote
  #11  
Old 01-12-2013, 11:15 AM
lagoonguy lagoonguy is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Location: Florida
Posts: 1,809
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Here's a link to an interestng scientific article (written in plain language) about how fish hear in the ocean
BillH
http://www.dosits.org/animals/soundreception/fishhear/
Reply With Quote
  #12  
Old 01-12-2013, 01:31 PM
Nifty Nifty is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location: MA
Posts: 812
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve C. Sink View Post
JOE-----many-many years ago, I would actually dive to the bottom of a lake and let my fishing buddy pull all kinds of plugs, plastic worms, etc. close to me, to determine if I could hear'em. A plastic worm with a small weight attached, sounded like a drunk stumbling over a rock pile. In all honesty, he never pulled an unweighted worm by me dragging it on the bottom, as I recall.
A plug does not have to have rattles in it to put off a hell of a sound, under water.

MULE.
This is so true, and now they have gadgets that can record the sounds of lures underwater. Even so, I think a fish' "gadgets" are much more sensitive.
Reply With Quote
  #13  
Old 01-12-2013, 03:09 PM
Frank Daignault's Avatar
Frank Daignault Frank Daignault is offline
Writer, Hunter, Surfcaster
 
Join Date: Sep 1999
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 30,458
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Fishermen all have to get over the analysis of senses in human terms. Some land animals have 10,000 times the sense of smell we have. But for us that is hard to fathom. If its dark humans can't see. Yet, a fish "sees" your lure in total darkness. Deer don't see colors but movement tips them off right quick. Throw your shadow over the water and gamefish haul ash. For many humans it is hard to imagine senses outside the scope of our own. Somebody ought to read Mark Sosin's Through the Fish's Eye.
__________________
Frank
Reply With Quote
  #14  
Old 01-12-2013, 10:14 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,807
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

I think any lure with a treble or single hook that swings off a metal eye or split ring makes some noise...I'm thinking little clicks on a slow retrieve. I'd bet when a Giant Pikie lands, it sounds like an earthquake in a hardware store.
Read of two guys fishing herring pattern flies, but the one who'd tied a fw bass worm rattle into his fly caught more. Herring make FRTs...fast repetitive ticks...fish farts! Google it...it's for real...
Reply With Quote
  #15  
Old 01-13-2013, 09:52 AM
clambellies clambellies is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: massachusetts
Posts: 788
Default Re: The Sounds Made by a Lure

Quote:
Originally Posted by joeaugeri View Post
a nice bottle or metal lip in the dark i can deffinatly think pressure waves sending out
something a fish could lock in on,but what about a needle ,a dropper or a buck tail? no wiggle ,wobble, nothing.
I was probably the last fisherman on earth (of my generation) that was convinced about the effectiveness of needlefish lures. I couldn't understand how they could be so motionless and work. Then one night I had to shine my light right on the water to pick my way through a length of lobster pot rope washed up on a bar and saw large sand eels just hanging suspended in the water. They moved very slow and very little, thy just sort of hung there. I suppose needlefish lures attract by imitating that sand eel pattern.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Favorite New Striper go to lure! oceancruze1 MAIN FORUM 9 05-11-2012 07:56 AM
Made in the USA etrexny1 MAIN FORUM 13 04-13-2011 09:00 AM
patentable surf eel lure idea. Important thread fishbeach8514 MAIN FORUM 3 01-30-2010 06:08 PM
Get A Key Made! passiton MAIN FORUM 14 06-11-2008 12:29 AM
Lure Saver row4fun MAIN FORUM 6 10-06-2006 01:53 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 05:01 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1998 - 2016 StriperSurf.com, All Rights Reserved