Home

 
     HOME     ARTICLES     Frank DAIGNAULT     TROPHY RIGS     CONTENTS     FAQs     FLY FISHING     OFF ROAD 4 X 4     STRIPED BASS    SURFCASTING
 
Go Back   StriperSurf Forums > Main Forums > Commercial - Recreational - Conservation Issues

Commercial - Recreational - Conservation Issues An open forum for the exchange of ideas and positions on current and proposed regulations in saltwater fishing and conservation.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #16  
Old 03-19-2005, 11:22 PM
Fish Tank Fish Tank is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Wilkes-Barre, PA
Posts: 3,857
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bob ECT:
The Bluefin fishery is set up based on the historic fishery as is everything else. Some people just don't have the history to understand it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So Bob, why won't you inform us about the history data; acquired regarding bluefin tuna?
I love history! It points out rather well, the ere in humanity's ways!!!
I'm all eyes bro'...
Teach me!!!
Reply With Quote
  #17  
Old 03-20-2005, 01:21 PM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bob ECT:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fish Picker:
I'm not buying a word of this BS. This is a issue that we want addressed. LTF almost touched on this earlier in the week. We addressed this very problem several time in the last 12 years. Each time the plan that we had put together was defeated. By whom you might ask ???? The Rec "powers that BE" and that is a fact !!!!!! Why would that be ???? Why doesn't RFA comment on this topic. Commercial license to sell. If you have this permit then that means your a comm and you have to play by our rules. Come on over player !!!!

Imagine a 50 Viking with 14 inch numbers painted on the side. Sorry No Sales For You </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

You tried to get live fish sales banned 12 years ago? If you're for banning the live fish sales and getting rid of the guys flying under the radar on this stuff please talk to Nils about it. Apparently he wants to protect these guys. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>


Please Re read We have been trying to get a LTS License To Sell. For some reason it keep gettin squashed BY ??????? HUMMMMMM
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #18  
Old 03-20-2005, 01:38 PM
Bob ECT Bob ECT is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 437
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fish Tank:
<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bob ECT:
The Bluefin fishery is set up based on the historic fishery as is everything else. Some people just don't have the history to understand it. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

So Bob, why won't you inform us about the history data; acquired regarding bluefin tuna?
I love history! It points out rather well, the ere in humanity's ways!!!
I'm all eyes bro'...
Teach me!!!
</div></BLOCKQUOTE>

Just review the data NMFS used to make the allocations between the comm catagories. Historically Bluefins were sold by small comm operators and charters in the NE, until the seiners moved in.
Reply With Quote
  #19  
Old 03-20-2005, 01:40 PM
Bob ECT Bob ECT is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 437
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fish Picker:

Please Re read We have been trying to get a LTS License To Sell. For some reason it keep gettin squashed BY ??????? HUMMMMMM </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

We're dealing with live fish sales here. Do you really think a LTS would stop anyone selling live tog? They care nothing about any laws. The only way to stop is to not allow rest's to have it.
Reply With Quote
  #20  
Old 03-20-2005, 02:10 PM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

Heck yeah !!!! We want this !!! You asked for a way to stop this I serve it up to ya and you say it is no good.

After we get the LTS into place then we put a SWL into affect when the bad guys get caught sellin the fish without a LTS they lose their SWL. AHHHHHH if you are honest then you have nothing to worry about.

Now I challenge your gang to show us who the PLAYERS are. REMEMBER once you have the LTS you crossed over you are now a Comm and ya have to abide by our LAWS. Do you think that you have that kind of game ?????


BTW I received my horn this morning I had to steam clean it for five hours it only took a second to rip that thing off of it. But the sticker left it stinking of crap.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #21  
Old 03-20-2005, 05:27 PM
LIVETOFISH LIVETOFISH is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: martinsville nj usa
Posts: 533
Default

LTS or saltwater liscense, it doesn't matter, it would have no effect on this market. these things are completely off the mark, either of these measures would only attempt to control what happens with the people that follow the recreational limits. the people that deal in this trade would not be hampered at all by these things since it holds no impact on them, they are keeping and selling everything they can catch, if they are busted they are busted, there is no incentive for them to have either liscense, as they are just as screwed even if they have these things. the only way that these people can be stpped is by the help of other consientious people from anglers to consumers to stop this through informing on the wrongdoers or convincing those who participate to stop. Frankly the biggest effort has to be concentrated imo at the consumer end and those who provide the fish to the end user, if the demand is not eliminated only an army will be able to stop some people from attempting to fufill the demand.

the other topics which really center around the sale of offshore fish catches such as recs selling tunas or sharks or swords. these are different topics which should be discussed on it's own thread and not hijack one that really has no bearing. there doesn't seem to be a lot of understanding about the issues with regard to the history, present, or future of these fisheries and somebody ought to start a thread about it so we can get into these things for some of the guys who fish from the beach and don't know about the way things are in the offshore fisheries.
__________________
Mate- Blue Chip Sportfishing 2004

"As the son of a son of a sailor I went out on the sea for adventure"
Reply With Quote
  #22  
Old 03-20-2005, 06:17 PM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

LTF it doesn't matter if it is a goldfish or a whale. If they put these permits into place it would certainly make it a lot easier for the enforcement officers to establish a case. License to Sell first that will weed out a few bad apples. Then to get the rest out put the Salt Water License into play. Now when the bad guys get caught they would lose there SWL, drivers license and gear. The second time they get caught jail time. By By bad guys.

Like I said those who truly play by the rules have nothing to worry about.

As far as the impact on the market I can tell that you have no idea how the market is effected when people try to sell there "catch of the Day" When people think they can offset the cost of there Hobby by sellin to a restaurant in a back door type of deal. They settle for pennies on the dollar then we come in and have a crappy market.

Don't even try to tell me that this doesn't happen in just one short month DRUM FISH will start to be caught. All of the sudden drum fish will be on everybody's menu. Now I know that there are only a few guys who even try to catch drum fish a small few to boot. So where did these fish come from and who got hurt by this ????? Yes us ! our market will get slashed and we have to fish for pennies only meaning one thing. I have to load the wagon to make a days wages.

Now this same scenario will play out all year long it starts with drum fish then sharks onto tuna and ends with Sea Bass and Tog in the fall.

So again I ask you to see just who the real players are. Do you have the kind of game to play by our rules and Regs ??????
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #23  
Old 03-20-2005, 07:35 PM
LIVETOFISH LIVETOFISH is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: martinsville nj usa
Posts: 533
Default

the market that the live fish sales occur would not be affected by a SWL, why if you are going to do things completely illegally would you pay for a liscense. there is no way to connect it to a driver's liscense without a law, and eveen then it's more incentive not to get a SWL in the first place. this is targeted at the sale of largely undersized live fish that are caught with no regard for whatever laws are in place liscense or no.

i understand why you guys get upset about what the sale of fish by recs in legal or illegal manners does to your market value, but it is a different issue than this. this is something that will benefit all involved except the poachers and should be welcomed with open arms and praised by all of us regardless of sponser.
__________________
Mate- Blue Chip Sportfishing 2004

"As the son of a son of a sailor I went out on the sea for adventure"
Reply With Quote
  #24  
Old 03-21-2005, 10:42 AM
Bob ECT Bob ECT is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 437
Default

FP,
Other states have a LTS and a SWL, live fish sales are still rampant there too. These people don't carry about that stuff, they also aren't interested in rec fishing. Just go to the local jetty and look for Vans from new york, you'll probably see a tank with lots of shorts in it.

So far they've shown no regard for any possession limits, size limits, or anything else.

Don't they have to have a permit to sell tog already?
Reply With Quote
  #25  
Old 03-22-2005, 04:19 AM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

LTF and Bob you are right bad guys are gonna do it regardless. However if there is a system and laws laid out with that system then that would be a excellent start. As far as those vans on the jetty I would call the local authorities. I see no difference if the fish is live or dead. A live tog or a dead tuna/ Drum fish/ Sword/ shark/etc etc etc.

I think you guys want it both ways here. The way I'm/we are proposing would certainly make it cut and dry. This would eliminate 99.9% of the bad guys. That is what we all want isn't it ????
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #26  
Old 03-22-2005, 04:24 AM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Bob ECT:
FP,
Other states have a LTS and a SWL, live fish sales are still rampant there too. These people don't carry about that stuff, they also aren't interested in rec fishing. Just go to the local jetty and look for Vans from new york, you'll probably see a tank with lots of shorts in it.

So far they've shown no regard for any possession limits, size limits, or anything else.

Don't they have to have a permit to sell tog already? </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

" So far they've shown no regard for any possession limits, size limits, or anything else."

My answer to that is simple enforcement needs to step it up. When you see wrong doings the local authorities need to be informed. This issue isn't going to go away over night. But I think it would be alot easier for the enforcement officers to no who's who and if what they are doing is legal.


"
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #27  
Old 03-22-2005, 04:31 AM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">the market that the live fish sales occur would not be affected by a SWL, why if you are going to do things completely illegally would you pay for a license. there is no way to connect it to a driver's license without a law, and Even then it's more incentive not to get a SWL in the first place. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>



If ya don't have the proper paper work and ya get caught ya get into a load of legal problems. It is that simple !!! heck tieing it into the drivers license would be simple. If the NJDMV was so messed up I would suggest going throught them to get the SWL.

BTW keep in mind the the SWL is the second part phase one is the license to sell.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #28  
Old 03-22-2005, 05:39 PM
hayswalt hayswalt is offline
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Ocean City, NJ
Posts: 808
Default

Just ban the sale of live fish in eating establishments- end of problem. Or follow those vans Bob was talking about and bust them and the place they are sold.
Reply With Quote
  #29  
Old 03-23-2005, 07:24 AM
Fish Picker's Avatar
Fish Picker Fish Picker is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Aug 2003
Location: Wildwood, NJ good ol USA
Posts: 4,373
Default

Why should eating establishments be punished. There are guys who are playing by the rules that sell live fish. If we want the bad guys out lets set the frame work up to get them out.

We could kill three birds with one slug. 1 Get the bad guys out, 2 A better thumb on monitoring, 3 Generate more funds. Damm if this ain't sounding better all the time.

If the RFA and Big Jim were truly interested in helping the stocks then they would be pushing for this as well. But you see they are not. They want there cake and ice cream as well. Boys ya can't have both. Lets get the line drawn and see just who the players are.

If ya sell fish that make you a COMM now ya have to play by the rules that we must play by once your here ya can't go back. Go ahead sell your tuna But ya might as well sell your striper gear as well.
__________________
Reply With Quote
  #30  
Old 03-23-2005, 10:05 AM
LIVETOFISH LIVETOFISH is offline
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: martinsville nj usa
Posts: 533
Default

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by Fish Picker:
If ya sell fish that make you a COMM now ya have to play by the rules that we must play by once your here ya can't go back. Go ahead sell your tuna But ya might as well sell your striper gear as well. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

now why would i want to sell my striper gear, sure i can't sell stripers, but why would i not be allowed to fish for them, i just can't sell stripers. i think it's a hell of an idea,if i could sell my hook and line caught fish hell that'd be great. i don't know what makes you think that a LTS would disqualify anyone from a tourney or fishing bass with a rod and reel, just like there's nothing stopping you guys from fishing bass recreationally. frankly it's a great idea, but i can't see how rec guys with a LTS being able to sell thier catch would be good for you, i would think it'd have you screaming about how it drove the market down. and which side of the quota would it be taken off from, the rec side since the guys would be classified recs with a LTS or the comm side since they are being sold.

i still don't think it'll make a dent in illegal live fish sales since the people doing it still won't give a crap since the targeted sellers keep all undersized fish and therefore are not going to be stopped by it. but if a LTS means i can fish all the time and pay for it by selling fish, i'm all for it.
__________________
Mate- Blue Chip Sportfishing 2004

"As the son of a son of a sailor I went out on the sea for adventure"
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Forum Jump


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 11:37 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1998 - 2016 StriperSurf.com, All Rights Reserved