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Ask Frank Daignault Frank Daignault is recognized as an authority on surf fishing for striped bass. He is the author of six books and hundreds of magazine articles. Frank is a member of the Outdoor Writers of America and lectures throughout the Northeast.

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  #16  
Old 07-20-2017, 04:10 PM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

Back to the original topic, my guess is that good writing no longer stands on its own. Not sure if it ever really did but I remember reading articles or essays with no photos.

Seems to me readrs want more and better pictures, and even video if that's feasible

Some magazine editors ( not sure about fishing) ask their contributors to submit blogs etc
I'm guessing this is all coming from what today's readers want?
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  #17  
Old 07-20-2017, 04:54 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

Everything is better today -- pictures, editing, contributions, communications with writers. Advertising is better done; I even know anglers who buy to read the advertising .... believe it or not. Publications are usually more sophisticated. Only thing is that in the old days, I never was left out of a reply when I had an article idea. Today, no response is common.
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  #18  
Old 07-20-2017, 11:12 PM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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Originally Posted by Francis Daignault View Post
Everything is better today -- pictures, editing, contributions, communications with writers. Advertising is better done; I even know anglers who buy to read the advertising .... believe it or not. Publications are usually more sophisticated. Only thing is that in the old days, I never was left out of a reply when I had an article idea. Today, no response is common.
Yes I agree with all of it but I wouldn't agree the writing is better. Maybe I'm wanting something that, with selective memory, seemed better than it really was.

I pick up a slick publication that cost me a bundle, I'll read two paragraphs and think 'geez' they couldn't edit out at least a couple of the tired cliches, or re-phrase it to show at least a little creativity?'

'Salt in his blood'
'Earned their stripes'
'Running on fumes'
'Seasoned pro'

But nice pictures Really nice.
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  #19  
Old 07-21-2017, 12:47 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

John, nothing is perfect. People today are more educated so your chance of seeing good literature in print is higher now than the old days. There are a lot of niche publications -- racing forms, shooting publications that teach wing shooting, even quail hunting. My late father subscribed to The American Small Stock Farmer and he consumed every page, every word. I know people here and elsewhere see mags as same old, same old. That was always the case. When I was a student in high school, I used to keep a copy of Outdoor Life and Field and Stream in my notebook which I read during lectures and study hall. It was more entertaining, for me at least, than Huck Finn.
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Old 07-21-2017, 03:17 PM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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John, nothing is perfect. People today are more educated so your chance of seeing good literature in print is higher now than the old days. There are a lot of niche publications -- racing forms, shooting publications that teach wing shooting, even quail hunting. My late father subscribed to The American Small Stock Farmer and he consumed every page, every word. I know people here and elsewhere see mags as same old, same old. That was always the case. When I was a student in high school, I used to keep a copy of Outdoor Life and Field and Stream in my notebook which I read during lectures and study hall. It was more entertaining, for me at least, than Huck Finn.
I couldn't afford to buy all the magazines but the school library had them... there were about 8 of us who were really interested in fishing and we would race each other to the library at recess to get ahold of the latest issues of Sports Afield, Field and Stream or Outdoor Life. February and March were the longest months of the year as we read up and waited for trout season.

My god, today's kids have access to publications plus blogs and chat boards

I think we read every article back then about 4-5 times. I doubt that happens today
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  #21  
Old 07-22-2017, 12:06 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

In school I had a bunch of similar buddies who read all the same magazines from the library. I remember Bob Saunders who died in a canoe accident guiding in Alaska. I recall Bob Lipka who lost a leg in the military and ran a tackle shop while fishing all his life. Both those guys became lifelong outdoorsmen who I would see in the field along the way. Outdoor reading had an influence on their lives.
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  #22  
Old 07-26-2017, 10:58 AM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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In school I had a bunch of similar buddies who read all the same magazines from the library. I remember Bob Saunders who died in a canoe accident guiding in Alaska. I recall Bob Lipka who lost a leg in the military and ran a tackle shop while fishing all his life. Both those guys became lifelong outdoorsmen who I would see in the field along the way. Outdoor reading had an influence on their lives.
Yes same here. All those guys from my school still fish heavily today. I'll get pictures and snippets from social media all the time. We had our own informal 'club' where we would sit at the lunch table and talk about fishing. We would often talk about the articles we had read. Once in a while a non fisherman would ask to come fishing and often the lack of commitment or skill was fodder for some good laughs the following Monday.

As stated earlier, getting access to stories and instructional articles wasn't the best. We had limited outlets and there was no google !
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  #23  
Old 07-27-2017, 12:08 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

Like you, I think all the outdoor magazines contributed an influential component to both our interest and results. As young people thursting to know more about fishing and hunting, the outdoor mags filled an important developmental niche in many of us. Even today I see adults, who started fishing or hunting late, and never subscribed to our outdoor media, have flaws in their angling development. Outdoor writers are teachers of fishing and of hunting.

I say this in contrast to the so called "fake news media" who tell lies about people under the protection of the first amendment and who seek to sway politics. Certainly, while both are "writers" there is a world of difference between bonefish in Belieze and falsely reporting a crime when there was no crime. We don't need President Trump to tell us what has gone on for years, though he happens to be correct.
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  #24  
Old 07-28-2017, 11:09 AM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

One change I have witnessed is that Salt Water Sportsman had taken shore fishing out of their editorial balance. I junior editor once told me that the add money justified dropping the surf. On the other hand, surfcasting has always been the seed stock of eventual transition to boats. The late editor, Frank Woolner, felt that way but he was overruled by the bean counters. I lost my gig there because of that; but then, when you write for 50 years, you lose a lot of gigs.
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  #25  
Old 07-29-2017, 08:54 AM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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One change I have witnessed is that Salt Water Sportsman had taken shore fishing out of their editorial balance. I junior editor once told me that the add money justified dropping the surf. On the other hand, surfcasting has always been the seed stock of eventual transition to boats. The late editor, Frank Woolner, felt that way but he was overruled by the bean counters. I lost my gig there because of that; but then, when you write for 50 years, you lose a lot of gigs.
Regulator, Yellowfin, Contender, Simrad, Garmin, Furuno, Yamaha, Mercury, Westmarine, Grundens, Seatow, Yeti, Taco, Raymarine .....dominate the add space of many of these magazines. Then again surf guys have no problem digging deep for Van Staal, but much of the market supplying goods are niche regional and small outfit fabrication shops. Surf Guys spend big on custom rolled rods, custom belts, limited production lures, limited production surf bags, limited or highly customized beach vehicles.
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  #26  
Old 07-29-2017, 09:41 AM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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Regulator, Yellowfin, Contender, Simrad, Garmin, Furuno, Yamaha, Mercury, Westmarine, Grundens, Seatow, Yeti, Taco, Raymarine .....dominate the add space of many of these magazines. Then again surf guys have no problem digging deep for Van Staal, but much of the market supplying goods are niche regional and small outfit fabrication shops. Surf Guys spend big on custom rolled rods, custom belts, limited production lures, limited production surf bags, limited or highly customized beach vehicles.
The expensive surf stuff is very inexpensive compared to boat related items. A VanStaal reel is probably less expensive than the T top (basically an umbrella to house some electronics and provide shade) on most 25' center console boats. I noticed a couple years back that Saltwater Sportsman Magazine has a seminar series that comes to different areas. When you register for it, they give you a gift package that consists of some off shore fishing analysis, fuel treatment, and boat polish. Hey SWS? How 'bout a gift with some actual hooks in it?!
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  #27  
Old 07-29-2017, 12:19 PM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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Originally Posted by SALMONMEISTER View Post
The expensive surf stuff is very inexpensive compared to boat related items. A VanStaal reel is probably less expensive than the T top (basically an umbrella to house some electronics and provide shade) on most 25' center console boats. I noticed a couple years back that Saltwater Sportsman Magazine has a seminar series that comes to different areas. When you register for it, they give you a gift package that consists of some off shore fishing analysis, fuel treatment, and boat polish. Hey SWS? How 'bout a gift with some actual hooks in it?!
Yes, but surf is still a bit of a niche market.

I still get a kick out of going offshore and trolling like 12 rods, and some lures don't even have hooks. But it is big money. 2 Deisels at about 2000 rpm going 24 knots is like cha Ching cha Ching cha Ching
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  #28  
Old 07-29-2017, 12:55 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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Yes, but surf is still a bit of a niche market.

I still get a kick out of going offshore and trolling like 12 rods, and some lures don't even have hooks. But it is big money. 2 Deisels at about 2000 rpm going 24 knots is like cha Ching cha Ching cha Ching
Definitely a good niche market... I just meant that the differences in costs between boat and surf stuff is substantial.

Nice fish John! Is that a subliminal advertisement for "Yellowfin" boats?
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  #29  
Old 07-29-2017, 03:58 PM
John_P John_P is offline
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

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Definitely a good niche market... I just meant that the differences in costs between boat and surf stuff is substantial.

Nice fish John! Is that a subliminal advertisement for "Yellowfin" boats?
Actually I have a Contender. I've never ridden a yellowfin yet. But see brand spanking new ones out there with 3 engines hanging off the back. I do find it quite interesting how sometimes the reputation of the boat plays into perceptions about the owner. I guess it's sort of like vehicles.

But getting back to the surf thing...what I can say with 100% unbiased honesty...the perception of a Surfcaster is extremely high among all class of boat people, and even those with fancy offshore boats. The perception is of a figure it out yourself guy who knows more about how wind and tide play into fish and bait movements, and of a guy who really knows his gear.

It's a lot easier to pay 1000 for an inshore charter or 2000 for an offshore charter and let the Captain find you fish, you reel them in and you can call yourself a good fisherman. Lol
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  #30  
Old 07-30-2017, 03:59 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
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Default Re: How have Outdoor READERS changed over the last 20-30 years?

"It's a lot easier to pay 1000 for an inshore charter or 2000 for an offshore charter and let the Captain find you fish, you reel them in and you can call yourself a good fisherman."

Johnny grab that!
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