Home
 
     HOME     ARTICLES     Frank DAIGNAULT     TROPHY RIGS     CONTENTS     FAQs     FLY FISHING     OFF ROAD 4 X 4     STRIPED BASS    SURFCASTING
 
Click for Daignault Biography Twenty Years Trophy Striper Striper Surf Striper Hot Spots MID-ATLANTIC Striper Hot Spots - NEW ENGLAND Eastern Tides Fly Fishing the Striper Surf
TWENTY YEARS ON THE CAPE - STRIPER SURF - STRIPER HOT SPOTS - THE TROPHY STRIPER
EASTERN TIDES - FLY FISHING THE STRIPER SURF
Welcome to Frank Daignault's "CASTS" - Center for Advanced Studies of Trophy Stripers.
Please be sure to read the Protocol and then join in!
 
 
Go Back   StriperSurf Forums > Main Forums > Ask Frank Daignault

Ask Frank Daignault Frank Daignault is recognized as an authority on surf fishing for striped bass. He is the author of six books and hundreds of magazine articles. Frank is a member of the Outdoor Writers of America and lectures throughout the Northeast.

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
  #31  
Old 12-04-2017, 04:43 PM
RobS's Avatar
RobS RobS is offline
SS / Curmudgeon / SSc Storm Watcher
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: living near the least productive waters of the NE
Posts: 16,612
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

Frank... you're killing me with this fly talk.

And then tell me to fogetaboudit!
__________________
-- Rob Switzer
~~~~~ ><((((?> ~~~~~
http://stripersandtrout.blogspot.com
Reply With Quote
  #32  
Old 12-05-2017, 05:00 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: MA
Posts: 816
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

Rifling of the fly it to tie it to your leader so that is side plains on the surface. Doing that, and current is needed for it to happen, the rifling fly leaves a small wake that drives some salmon bonkers. Fifty casters can go through a pool without a rise over a multitude of fish, but when a fly rides the flow leaving a wake some salmon will come up and take the fly bold enough to exhibit such deliberate, insulting nonchalance. Inasmuch as never learned the knots purported to be suitable for a presentation, I inadvertently fished wrong which caused my scruffy black bear to riffle. Some fishermen saw my fly riffling but they dispelled it and those who knew I was using the technique did not know how to make it that tantalizing vee on the river surface. One morning on the Penobscot I released five adult salmon with a rifling fly when one man among 30 caught ONE salmon. I had those Atlantic salmon by the nuts!
Reply With Quote
  #33  
Old 12-05-2017, 06:58 PM
Tin Boat Tin Boat is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 307
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

Ever tried riffling in the salt? Inlets, harbour mouths, rips, etc ?
Reply With Quote
  #34  
Old 12-05-2017, 10:43 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,716
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

I'm convinced a "V" wake on the surface, and under the right conditions, is attractive to many species:

Boats trolling off shore for billfish leave a big v wake which may be seen from below. Behind the boat, lures are slid along the surface, also making a wake.

The riffling hitched wet fly as Frank mentioned.

Without a riffling hitch, holding a fly in the current downstream of your casting position, raise your fly rod high while very slowly retrieving a small fly or nymph until it is barely touching the surface downstream of you...line and leader off the water. Keep very slowly pulling it toward you with that wake. You'd be surprised at the number of fish that will follow and then take almost under the rod tip. I've gotten quite a few smallmouth bass and trout doing this, although, they're usually small fish.
Reply With Quote
  #35  
Old 12-06-2017, 03:07 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: MA
Posts: 816
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Boat View Post
Ever tried riffling in the salt? Inlets, harbour mouths, rips, etc ?
Yes, it works everywhere -- trout streams, striper outflows. But you have to stay on top by tieing the fly properly with a floating line in current. You have to be floating high in order to create the visible wake. Salmon fishing I also used two flies where both riffled. It is very unlikely that you would hook two salmon at once; its not that good. Those intimate with my striper experience should understand that the two fly dropper is classic Frank. I brought my striper background to salmon fishing.

Naturally, more discussion is welcome. Speaking of my striper background, where would salmon fishing at night fall in this? Ask.....
Reply With Quote
  #36  
Old 12-06-2017, 05:46 PM
RobS's Avatar
RobS RobS is offline
SS / Curmudgeon / SSc Storm Watcher
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: living near the least productive waters of the NE
Posts: 16,612
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

I know night fishing for browns, searuns or otherwise, kicks arsh.

Never read about it for salmon of any sort, though. One would think Atlantics "close enough" to browns to exhibit similar tendencies, but maybe not in the natal rivers.
__________________
-- Rob Switzer
~~~~~ ><((((?> ~~~~~
http://stripersandtrout.blogspot.com
Reply With Quote
  #37  
Old 12-06-2017, 11:57 PM
Tin Boat Tin Boat is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 307
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

A topwater V is a hallmark of the Gurgler, invented by the late and iconic fly tyer Jack Garside. No need to riffle. Stripers love them!
Reply With Quote
  #38  
Old 12-07-2017, 03:57 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: MA
Posts: 816
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

[quote=Tin Boat;2431702]A topwater V is a hallmark of the Gurgler, invented by the late and iconic fly tyer Jack Garside. No need to riffle. Stripers love them![/QUOT

Phil Farnsworth fashioned a "slider" that was of cork, color, and a tuft of deer hair on the tail. Bein as it was basically cork the thing floated and left a Vee wake like the riffle knot. The wake was not subtle on the "slider". But I never used the slider for salmon because I was salmon fishing with the riffle hitch before I met Farnsworth and his slider. This of course raises questions about the vee wake: should it be subtle like the riffle hitch, or should it be exaggerated/ way overblown?

Regarding night fishing for salmon, my striper background led me directly to thoughts of "fishing with the owls," as the Mainers say. Nobody fishes at night in Maine so asking about night salmon fishing is wildly intergalacticly right over their bald heads. I tried it one night and was not surprised that salmon hit even better in the dark. Not only that but, though legal, nobody else does it. So there is no rotation, nobody around to bitch about lead footing through the pools. If you raise a fish you can stand there and swing over the buggar's head until the Second Sunday after Pentacost. On the other hand it is kind of lonely and lacks the social setting that springs from waiting for your turn to go through. Everything feeds and is active at night -- deer, ducks, geese, all species of fish. Only turkeys sleep at night.
Reply With Quote
  #39  
Old 12-07-2017, 04:15 PM
RobS's Avatar
RobS RobS is offline
SS / Curmudgeon / SSc Storm Watcher
 
Join Date: Oct 2002
Location: living near the least productive waters of the NE
Posts: 16,612
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

That's good news about night fishing for salmon. Maybe I can get the best runs to myself?

At the risk of digression, I've never caught brookies at night... and on the rivers I used to fish for them, the bite died with the light, which fed my behavior to not try much for them in the off hours.
__________________
-- Rob Switzer
~~~~~ ><((((?> ~~~~~
http://stripersandtrout.blogspot.com
Reply With Quote
  #40  
Old 12-08-2017, 03:51 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: MA
Posts: 816
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

As pointed out several times here by members, brown trout are notorious night feeders. Years ago I used to walk the shores of nearby Wallum Lake, which was managed for trophy browns, and just listen while smoking my pipe. They always fed right up against the bank, a foot or two out, one place where ants fell from the trees. I used to fish a floating cricket because I liked watching it in the limited light. If a brown had swirled for an ant, I could be certain that the cricket would pull his pants down.
Reply With Quote
  #41  
Old 12-08-2017, 04:44 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,716
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

There's a good website that rhymes with fishmadmandotcom (fishmadman.com)that gives lots of info on waking flies and the riffling or Portland hitch for Atlantic Salmon. Of particular interest, click on "ways to fish" on the top bar. The drop down will give you "riffling hitch" as an option. In that section they also mention tube flies, where flies are tied on a thin tube, the leader is passed through the tube, and tied to a short shank hook. The fish is less likely to become unhooked during a fight than with a long shanked hook. MORE interesting is that sometimes they pass the leader through a hole in the side of the tube, then down the tube to the hook. This way of attaching a tube fly results in the fly "waking" without the use of the hitch. Elsewhere on the site, are other "wakers"...some similar to the Gurgler.

A trend we noticed on MV is that some guys are fishing a floating sandeel imitation...very thin, buoyant, and leaves a subtle wake. Some of the beaches we fish there have minimal current where (I believe) a floating fly may wake better than a hitched fly.
Reply With Quote
  #42  
Old 12-08-2017, 04:54 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,716
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

[quote=Francis Daignault;2431706]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tin Boat View Post
A topwater V is a hallmark of the Gurgler, invented by the late and iconic fly tyer Jack Garside. No need to riffle. Stripers love them![/QUOT

Phil Farnsworth fashioned a "slider" that was of cork, color, and a tuft of deer hair on the tail. Bein as it was basically cork the thing floated and left a Vee wake like the riffle knot. The wake was not subtle on the "slider". But I never used the slider for salmon because I was salmon fishing with the riffle hitch before I met Farnsworth and his slider. This of course raises questions about the vee wake: should it be subtle like the riffle hitch, or should it be exaggerated/ way overblown?

Regarding night fishing for salmon, my striper background led me directly to thoughts of "fishing with the owls," as the Mainers say. Nobody fishes at night in Maine so asking about night salmon fishing is wildly intergalacticly right over their bald heads. I tried it one night and was not surprised that salmon hit even better in the dark. Not only that but, though legal, nobody else does it. So there is no rotation, nobody around to bitch about lead footing through the pools. If you raise a fish you can stand there and swing over the buggar's head until the Second Sunday after Pentacost. On the other hand it is kind of lonely and lacks the social setting that springs from waiting for your turn to go through. Everything feeds and is active at night -- deer, ducks, geese, all species of fish. Only turkeys sleep at night.
I know that some fish the Gurgler as a popper that doesn't pop...instead it...well...you know...gurgles on a jerky retrieve.

I think some fish "regroup" at sunset... I've heard others say it as well. They catch at sunset...slows down for awhile...then picks up.

I haven't caught any pike or pickerel at night, even hours after dark in waters where I'd caught them in daylight. It's probably just me 'cause musky...big ones...are known to be targeted at night.
Reply With Quote
  #43  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:29 PM
Francis Daignault Francis Daignault is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: May 2016
Location: MA
Posts: 816
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

A million things work in fishing. That is why a person can write an entire book fishing for one species. I laud fly fishing for stripers. Yet my book on the subject is a dog that won't get out of its advance.

Incidently, the late Lee Wulff wrote a marvelous "The Atlantic Salmon" years ago in which he mentions the riffle or Portland Hitch, which are the same. Its commonly used in Atlantic salmon fishing but I never saw it done in Maine for some reason.

When we went to Quebec salmon fishing I put my youthful French to work. They are very sensitive about language and nearly had a civil war before French became the official language. Consequently, and I hope I not taken too long with this my meager efforts at use of French socially endeared me with a lot of the locals on the Matapedia River. Keep in mind that I spent two years in the first grade because I could not speak English. Later, I taught my Mother English. I was called "Frenchy" until I was in high school. Point is, the Quebec frogs were astonished to see an American speaking French and I was popular on the salmon pool benches waiting for my rotation. I made a friend, Yves, who took me out to a secret spot for trut de la mer which are sea-run brookies. Yves's English was as bad as my French.
Reply With Quote
  #44  
Old 12-09-2017, 04:43 PM
SALMONMEISTER SALMONMEISTER is offline
SS/Veteran
 
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: NY
Posts: 1,716
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

Art Lee (author of several books, and editor at large of The Atlantic Salmon Journal) has a book on fishing the riffling hitch. In it he disagrees with Lee Wulff's method of tying it.
Reply With Quote
  #45  
Old 12-09-2017, 07:08 PM
Tin Boat Tin Boat is online now
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 307
Default Re: Fishing for Atlantic Salmon

A pencil-width styrofoam tube with a hole drilled or punched down its length can be fitted over most flies and transform them to floaters or sliders. Length of tube is determined by size of fly. Simple and effective.

When I was getting skunked in Scotland I learned that ordering whisky in a bar meant only one thing: Bells scotch, neat. Requesting ice was an insult to the country and the deities of drink.
Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Winter Flounder lagoonguy Ask Frank Daignault 61 03-22-2015 03:10 PM
Local Fishing Flea Markets 2010 Jess Public Service Notices & Events 1 02-02-2010 05:16 AM
Fishing v Sex Frank N The Mudhole 0 02-09-2006 04:25 PM
Workshop for newbies to surf fishing..BOW Surf Fishing Workshop chris c Fishing - New Jersey 2 09-16-2005 11:53 AM
JCAA Statement for the NMFS November 18 Hearing to open the EEZ for Striped Bass Fishing. the broken bobber MAIN FORUM 1 11-15-2003 05:44 PM


All times are GMT -4. The time now is 08:38 PM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.6.6
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright 1998 - 2016 StriperSurf.com, All Rights Reserved